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No Ohio push for gun insurance

Calif. proposal would require coverage

March 4, 2013

Drivers must carry liability insurance on their vehicles, so why not require similar coverage for gun owners? That’s apparently the thought behind a proposed California law that would force anyone......

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(42)

stickhauler

Mar-07-13 12:17 AM

Nascarnut, no matter the court rulings pertaining to mentally ill patients, the fact remains, 3 of the 4 mass murderers in recent memory were being treated by mental health professionals, and none of the 3 were reported. One, the shooter in Auroea, CO, even sent his written "plans" for his crime to his therapist. So, I'd wager the subject had come up in their discussions.

I notice your post states the professional "may inform." "May inform" is a long way from it being the law that they MUST inform. You state that they "may" be held responsible should their patient harm someone. Again, far from "will be held responsible."

And absent any prosecution of a mental health professional for failure to inform, that all sounds more voluntary than mandatory.

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NasCarNut

Mar-06-13 10:20 AM

In recent years, many courts have held that doctors also owe duties to protect non-patients who may be harmed by patients. For example, without a patient's permission or knowledge, doctors may warn others or the police if the patient is mentally unstable, potentially violent, or has threatened a specific person. In some states, the duty to report or warn others "trumps" the right to confidentiality or privileged communication with a doctor. Courts will decide these matters by balancing the sanctity of the confidentiality against the foreseeability of harm to a third party.

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stickhauler

Mar-05-13 11:59 PM

asknot, call me cynical if you will, but I've come to the point that if the head of anything connected with our government told me the sky was blue, I'd be asking around for a 2nd opinion.

Stating that there is a huge backlog in adding people to the database would play into the administration's push for more restrictive laws, wouldn't it? These department heads know which side their bread is buttered on, they follow the narrative the "boss" puts out there.

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jh6396

Mar-05-13 9:43 PM

I am not sure what is on the form 4473 (tried downloading but it didn't work) but I assume one would have to volunteer mental health issues since those records are protected in most, if not all, states.

This is where insurance makes sense. Insurance companies can have access to a persons medical history and deny a license if they see a risk. And anyone who claims this is denying someone of their 2nd amendment right needs to know that the alternative means mentally ill people will have guns. This is a compromise to keep the information private but keep them from buying guns.

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thegreek

Mar-05-13 5:55 PM

Stickhauler, If my memory serves me correctly, I think Holmes psychaitrist in Aurora is in some legal trouble for not reporting him as a danger to society. They arent letting anything out about Newtown so I havent heard anything on that.

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stickhauler

Mar-05-13 5:24 PM

So, if mental health professionals are REQUIRED to report those who are a danger to society, explain how the shooters at Phoenix, Auroea and Newtown were NOT reported?

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irisheyes

Mar-05-13 5:07 PM

I agree that anyone owning a firearm should have to aquire insurance to do so in case they do something like SHOOT someone!

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thegreek

Mar-05-13 4:56 PM

I respect your candor in this discussion. It is not easy to deal with mental illness. It is in my family. I know.

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thegreek

Mar-05-13 4:53 PM

Point well taken Ohoiankev. We are talking about the violent mentally ill here. The ones with a crimminal record. Have been in jail or released back into society with uneffective medical treatmant or the ones that have threatened family, friends or authority with violence on numerous occassions and were released due to lack of facilities or effective treatments. We realize there is a difference. Thank you for your comment. Seriously.

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ohioankev

Mar-05-13 12:48 AM

One last thing. While I have no desire to own a firearm I do that gun owners don't need another tax in the form of insurance. Also I'm not totally against the government compiling a database of mentally ill people but the thought that every person with mental illness is the problem is absurd and really irks me.

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ohioankev

Mar-05-13 12:38 AM

And i'm bi polar with a personality disorder and never had the urge to kill someone. So how am I the problem in this issue ? I'd much rather be alone, isolated and away from people like you.

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ohioankev

Mar-05-13 12:37 AM

Stickhauler you are wrong. If a therapist knows that you are a threat to others they have to alert the authorities. Of course if they feel you are a threat to yourself they'll give you a 72 hour vacation. (maybe)

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stickhauler

Mar-05-13 12:23 AM

asknot, I find that claim very difficult to believe. The "No Fly" list has been around half the time the background check system has, and it's even filled with names of little children.

The NiCS's system depends on the FBI's criminal records division, and there are "holds" put on some transfers because the buyer has a common name, or there's somewith their name that has a criminal record. I doubt seriously that the FBI lacks the manpower to add criminals names to the data base.

There is a void of information on people with mental health issues, that one is the government's fault! Laws exist that prevent mental health professionals from reporting patients that are a danger to society, based on privacy issues.

Yet, in this entire debate, there is total push to punish law abiding gun owners, when the mentally ill are the true issue.

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stickhauler

Mar-05-13 12:23 AM

asknot, I find that claim very difficult to believe. The "No Fly" list has been around half the time the background check system has, and it's even filled with names of little children.

The NiCS's system depends on the FBI's criminal records division, and there are "holds" put on some transfers because the buyer has a common name, or there's somewith their name that has a criminal record. I doubt seriously that the FBI lacks the manpower to add criminals names to the data base.

There is a void of information on people with mental health issues, that one is the government's fault! Laws exist that prevent mental health professionals from reporting patients that are a danger to society, based on privacy issues.

Yet, in this entire debate, there is total push to punish law abiding gun owners, when the mentally ill are the true issue.

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ProdigalSon

Mar-04-13 8:24 PM

@verymad - The National Instant Criminal Background Check System has been in effect for 20 years. Anyone wanting to buy a firearm from a licensed dealer is required to complete a form 4473 and then submits to a background check with the FBI or other designated agency. The information sought on the 4473 is more extensive than information sought for working with children or elders.

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OLERETERIEDMWT

Mar-04-13 7:11 PM

LIZ U KNAILD IT

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exofDevola

Mar-04-13 2:45 PM

Rocker and Josh- Funny-you are both good with the one liners! I think Stiff has gone underground and intends to make a screen name change!

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thegreek

Mar-04-13 2:25 PM

If so we need to give Workingstiff a medal for "cruel and unusual punishment" having to listen to that garbage that Oneill spews is worse than flushing the toilet and it backs up all over the bathroom floor.!!!!

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slogoin

Mar-04-13 2:09 PM

Rocker,now THATS funny! lol

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rocker

Mar-04-13 1:36 PM

Maybe oneill is holding WORKINGSTIFF

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JoshBrown

Mar-04-13 12:49 PM

@oldhickory WorkingStiff went duck hunting with Former VP Cheney and Joe Biden........

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scandalous

Mar-04-13 12:21 PM

Daddy doesn't lock up his gun. Johnny has Susie over to play. Susie shoots herself in the face with the gun. Insurance invoked.

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thegreek

Mar-04-13 12:18 PM

AND, how in the world would insurance have any affect on these crimes that were committed at Sandy Hook and Colorado or anywhere.???? NONE...It is just another knee jerk scheme to do something to punish the legal gun owners. Proves it is all a big dog and pony show for re election purposes!!! It will not change the maniacs minds when they decide to flip out!! You wanna curb gun violence?? Listen to the NRA and do what they suggest instead of all this useless crap!!

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thegreek

Mar-04-13 12:03 PM

It is also wrong that we have to carry uninsured and underinsured motorist because others are driving without insurance or enough insurance. Insurance is a ripoff that needs some serious reform... Just like taxes and entitlements, need reform.

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thegreek

Mar-04-13 12:00 PM

California and New York let out more prisoners than any other states. They have a problem and expect the entire country to follow their lead because they are derelect of their duties. We should sell California to Mexico and New York to Canada at a VERY cheap price to get rid of those losers. Besides. I already have homeowners insurance on all of my contents and extra gun insurance thru the NRA. But it is not to cover some maniac stealing them to kill with.!! It for loss only.

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